An Open Letter for the Rector of PETRONAS University of Technology

DISCLAIMER:
THIS OPEN LETTER IS MY OWN OPINION, FROM MY OWN POINT OF VIEW OF LOOKING AT THE CURRENT STATE OF AFFAIRS IN UTP. IT DOES NOT REPRESENT UTP STUDENTS AS A WHOLE, NEITHER IT TRIES TO REPRESENT THEM. SOME MIGHT NOT AGREE, SOME MIGHT, BUT I BELIEVE THOSE WHO LIVED DURING THE TRADITIONAL LEGACY OF UTPCHAT AND THOSE WHO ARE INVOLVED IN THE COMMUNITY ONCE SURROUNDING UTPCHAT AND GRAPEVINE WOULD AGREE TO SOME, IF NOT ALL, OF MY POINTS BELOW.

Dear Datuk Dr Zainal Abidin Haji Kasim,

I am Mohd Izhar Firdaus Ismail (ID 7857), an ICT student in UTP from batch Jan2005, and also one of the active UTPchat IRCOperators. I am writing this because I feel like UTP action of forcing UTPchat to it knees several semesters ago is giving a bad impact on community life in UTP. A bad impact which caused UTP to waste the potential of the (so-called) 'cream de la cream' which UTP have grabbed early after their SPM examination.

UTPchat IRC Network, existed originally around more than 10 years ago, is an IRC (Internet Relay Chat) network for UTP students to socialize, do activities, as a community environment, place of discussions , and many more. We existed inofficially in the UTP network, yet was known by basically all UTP students and to some extends, staffs. The IRC network flourished as a place where UTP students meet each other, have fun, explore possibilities, voice opinions, share informations, bring up talents, and much more. UTPchat, indirectly contributes to the community spirit of which previous UTP graduates have. The spirit of caring each other, spirit of protecting what they believe is right, spirit of being a part and contributing to a community.

However, a change on 2005 in UTP network infrastructure, which separated the 5 villages in UTP to 5 separate networks, and an unexpected incident which relates to a stupidity of one of UTP's own student, caused UTPchat to face problem from UTP Management due to false accusation from those who don't understand the technical details behind the infrastructure. We faced trouble of keeping our infrastructure intact from the seemingly unstoppable mental and technical attack from UTP managements, thus lead to UTPchat's decline from the student's hearts.

The downfall of UTPchat , followed by the downfall of Grapevine, a LAN based discussion board indirectly affect the UTP students, their ability to voice their opinions truly from their hearts, in term of their ability to live as a community which care each other because they care. UTP students, indirectly became a group of people who only care for themselves, and do stuff for rewards/accreditation/certificate rather than doing stuff because they love doing it. This can be reflected by the decline of informal activities by students, the reduction of events/movements/groups in UTP which values creativity-building and community building, and the worst, UTP students no longer bother to protect their rights - which can be greatly reflected from the lack of interest for MPPUTP, lack of interest to try to make a change, lack of interest to voice their opinions. I believe that these downfall of other community movements in UTP was indirectly affected from the downfall of the medium where they communicate and voice their thoughts.

UTP students now, are more like a bunch of heartless robots, who come to UTP, simply for studying, to get their degree. They joined events because they wanted certificates, because they wanted to put those in their resume. We have lost the people who do stuff because they love it, do stuff because they care about it, do stuff because of pure interest without bothering for certificates, without bothering for accreditation, etc. UTP students now, they simply do whatever they have been told, without really questioning whether the decision are really good for them or not. They have lost their ability to voice out their opinions, they have lost their ability to fight, they have lost their ability to stand up and be true to themselves. The culture of previous UTP students, is just not there.

I remember that several years ago, during my junior days, UTP was such a fun place to be. Students from different batch, different courses, different races, different nation, mix with each other and befriend each other as equals. It was easy during that time to share thoughts and information with other friends. I miss the time when student are loud in declaring their opinions, their views about things, their suggestions. I miss the time when there exist a communication medium and a bond between students and other UTP residents through the network. I miss the time when UTP was filled with people who I can say that they are respectable people. I miss the time where there are a lot of creative thinker community in UTP, people who explores and create new ideas and stuff regardless what public says about them, people who are willing to try because of pure interest rather than being forced.

What happened to UTP motto of creating so called 'Well-Rounded Students'?. Is that motto is simply a way to get students to come in and study in UTP and make them slaves (read: robots) who simply follow what their master told them to do?. Or does the definition of 'Well-Rounded' for the UTP Management means, people who spend more time on studying to get 4.0 CGPA? people who are obedient to orders? people who can be easily controlled? people who doesnt fight for their rights? people who only know what their course and events they joined taught them and can't do anything else? people who do things for rewards not because they really want to do it? Does getting 4.0 really matters if a student is only good academically but can't really apply what they have learn for the betterment of the nation? Reminds me of a poem by Robert Frost - The Road Not Taken. How willing are us to go against the flow and make a change?.

Sir, I'm asking you, "Is that what you want it to be?". If yes, so be it. There are still 2 or 3 batch of students from the old legacy in UTP, the generations who still carry the spirit of community from our seniors, and we are slowly reducing in number every semester. The new students, from my observations, are more interested in studying, excel in university's co-curriculum, rather than living as a community. Newer students mostly match my description of a bunch of robots, or, more likely, a bunch of obedient high school students, NOT university students who are adventurous to explore more in what they learn and louder to voice their opinions. The culture of previous UTP graduates are just not there in their hearts. Once these 2 or 3 batch of students graduated, I'm afraid thats the end, both for UTPchat and wholeness of UTP graduates.

Yes, I know posting this kind of thing is bad for UTP reputation and might be bad for me too. But something need to be done. Something need to change. Sitting behind the scene , complaining, ranting and watching the communities die won't get us to anywhere. A university is a place where students learn to utilize their potential, a place for students to develop their creativity beyond what being taught in class, beyond the academic perspective. There exist people with lots of talent and potential in UTP, but their potential got limited due to the restrictions put on them.

There are still a lot of points I wanted to raise to you sir, but they are more in the technical term rather than the points above which relates to 'soft' values of UTP students. So, I would keep those for later. If this letter somehow offended the some of the readers due to my sharp words, I am sorry for that.

Regards.

Comments

aalim said…
:)
S0ulBLadE said…
Excellent effort, I'm eager to know UTP management's response to this.
easternC said…
^__^ iLIKE...
Anonymous said…
tak payah la..buat malu je antar..baru berapa tahun kenal utp,kencang sembang.
yo-chan[Ex-July2001] said…
keep up the good work.Please knock some sense into them.
shera usagi said…
I totally agree wif u~ support2 kage!~ =)
Shern Shiou said…
I wish to see it return to original form before i left here.. bless
bmahendran said…
as a final year student here in UTP now, I have to agree to certain extend of this post content.

I can see juniors are now a bunch of emotionless people, who are not showing skills and the much needed characteristics of a well-rounded student.

It wasn't the same when I came in 4 1/2years ago.

kage : expect sum 'feedbacks' from UTP/petronas for ur blog kekekee..mati2
Mohd Najmie said…
1. btol ke kau anta ke rektor? hopefully ko bukan sekadar sembang kencang
if so, congratulations

2. I totally agree on these points
- mirc and grapevine does contribute to the spirit of community
- utp students no longer bother to protect their rights hence the lack of interest towards mpp
- utp students only join events for the sake of certificates and not for the experience
- utp's misdefinition of well-rounded graduates as 4.0 flat students

3. probably u should include some suggestions
don't make the letter sounds like a personal bombardment to the rector
waimeng said…
bagus2
KageSenshi said…
Thanks all for the comments

@Najmie

yes, I have sent the link to this post through email. His secretary replied that he is currently in India until thursday, guess we'll wait until friday for his official response.

==
3. probably u should include some suggestions
don't make the letter sounds like a personal bombardment to the rector
==

I did not put suggestions because I am not trying to demand stuff through this open letter. It supposed to be an eye opener for rector, and perhaps, lecturers, and staffs.

Why bother to ask if they did not want to listen?. So I refuse to suggest things this early. Once the UTP willing to listen to us, we will be glad to serve and provide our opinion to make the change. Solution for this requires input and views from several ways - as UTP management , as student, and as people who care. If I suggest from my point of view, it might not be desirable from UTP's view.

So, I would rather wait for the response.
Anonymous said…
great job. eager to know the outcome of this. let us outside of utp know. :D
Anonymous said…
In other words, "rector, we want to be able to waste time on chatting in IRC" :)
grow up kidz..
zzz
what a shame...
KageSenshi said…
Adults dont post as anonymous.

Anonymous are people who are either kids, or people afraid to protect what they believe on. Or people who are afraid that they are wrong and dont want to accept that they are wrong.

Btw ppl. Do NOT Feed the Trolls.
Anonymous said…
kalau stakat buh kt sni xguna....hanta kt emel die trus aa tgk....ko buh kt blog ni pn umpama ko nk credit gk....be matured la....lgpn die tu rektor....lau ko xsuke, ko leh kua je utp tu....hahaha
KageSenshi said…
I have sent this to his email .. and already get a response from his secretary that he will read this on Friday

This is an open letter. An open letter is a letter where it is available for others to read.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_letter
Y0nd13 said…
First of all my dear Kagesenshi :

Do not feed the TroLLs.

It's too late already muhahhaa

It hurts me to see such lame comment from cik nony cik nony [refering to anonymous] sekalian.


This is not a matter of (suka tak suka).

Stop accusing this lame (malay drama scripts) dear cik nony. The link to this open letter had already been sent to the Rector. Otherwise how would you expect him to read it in here? (Unlike some of you guys who loves to taunting the university rules and regulation behind the backs).


The idea of giving more freedom inside the Networks doesn't restricly focus on happily chatting/downloading merrily 24/7. But the IRC itself seems to be the most simplest form of exchanging/sharing/collebrating knowledge. True everything have double edge sword. Heck even the elearning moodle can be use for nonsense stuff. Regardless on how will the service be use or abused.

To cik nony pukul 4:27pm. How many years does it take to know UTP? more than 3 years ? 4 years? or until final year? If that's the time you need to take to know something, it's like an ape wanted to be a man.

Again.. Nice open letter by the way :p
Anonymous said…
gzBtw i m posting as anonymous bcoz it s easy, juz tick at anonymous :)
dont act like u r "so adult" when u bring up things like this...duh..
zzz..haih...ni la kanak2
adult dont post as anonymous? lol
KageSenshi said…
@yondie

haha .. sorry dude .. sometimes the temptation is hard to avoid .. :P

==
@all readers.

Like Yondie said: IRC is just a technology, its how the technology is utilized that made the difference.

the IRC technology was originally developed during the early age of Internet as a medium for professors between universities to communicate, collaborate, and share information.

However, in Malaysia, it was introduced as a place for idle chat and Malaysians get the impression IRC is bad. But thats the users who are using it for idle chat, the technology is just plain-text-transfer between computers. No such thing as a bad technology

Freenode.Net is one of the example of current IRC network which utilize IRC as a full group collaboration and communication medium. There, a lot of Open Source projects and created channels as a place for their developers from all around the world to communicate and work together and also as a place for their users to help each other. The company I am working now utilize IRC for our meetings and discussion room and we are comfortable with it. Heck, I was hired through IRC channel. FedoraProject.Org , an open source project which I am volunteering and participating in, utilize a lot of IRC and network based technologies for communication between developers and users.

In UTPchat, there is one channel, #linux, which utilizes IRC as a place for knowledge sharing and helping each other with problems and technical issues we faced.

Other fields which is not related to computer can also benefit from technologies provided that its utilized in a way it should. Provided that it is easily accessible by all. Eg: a channel can be created #chemicalanalysis and the lecturer related will access this channel from his/her office. Students who want to ask questions related to the subject can ask at the channel and the lecturers and people in the channel who knows the answer can help by discussing there.

The points above are some of the 'technical related points' which i stated at the end of my letter. These are related to utilization of technology which are much better if can be discussed properly with people who have the authority. There are still more points in my head which can still be put down.

Technologies was created to benefit mankind. Its a waste if capacity and knowledge in the technology but does not utilize it.
KageSenshi said…
*s/wasted if capacity/wasted if we have capacity/
KageSenshi said…
Some link/resources

http://irc.ocf.berkeley.edu/ -
Web client to the IRC servers of University of California, Berkeley. (can also be joined through '/server irc.ocf.berkeley.edu' on your IRC client)

http://oit.montclair.edu/resources/studentirc.html -
A good example of a university utilizing IRC

http://crew.ccs.neu.edu/wiki/?IRC -
another IRC deployment in a university (this one by a club)

http://wiki.collegiumv.org/index.php/Irc , http://collegiumv.net/
IRC network in Collegium V college of University of Texas

http://chat.csun.edu/java/irc.cgi -
An IRC server for California State University, Northridge (can also be entered through '/server chat.csun.edu' from your IRC client).

http://www.csun.edu/~webteach/Software_home.htm -
A resource site for web based teaching by California State University. IRC related here

http://lone-eagles.com/articles/tencollab.htm -
An article on how to utilize IRC and 9 other technologies for K12 education (K12 education is a education system used for primary and secondary education in North America)

http://www.twc.org/resources/writers-on-teaching-writing/computers-in-the-classroom -
another article related to IRC in education. This one is an interview of a teacher who utilize IRC for his class.

http://systemstatus.umn.edu/bin/view/Main/SystemInternetRelayChat -
server status of the IRC server for University of Minessota, I cant find the page that dedicated for the description of it, but the IRC server address is clearly stated here - http://www1.umn.edu/adcs/network/config.html . This server is a part of another larger international IRC network called EFnet.

http://www.srcf.ucam.org/ -
Student-Run Computing Facility of University of Cambridge. Their IRC server is irc.srcf.ucam.org .

== Papers ==
http://research.jimhudson.org/publications/icls00.pdf -
Case study , using IRC for language learning.

http://www.me.utexas.edu/~koen/ETH/gsw.pdf -
Use of Internet Relay Chat (IRC) in Distributed Consensus Forming

Credits to Yondie for helping out with the googling.
Anonymous said…
they must be a reason to the new infrastructure of the LAN network im sure towards the better.i have seen better the IRC being abused in so many ways. and i think all the "benefits" you want from this IRC is already provided to you. its totally harsh to say MPPUTP lack interest. the voting system proves ppl's belief in their capabilities. and do too provided CGPA for all grapevine members. and lets see if youre close to "wellrounded". wellrounded is not AVERAGE, its excellent in all areas.
obefiend said…
Effi Weiland in the house. Former owner and admin of Grapevine

i have to admit i'm not an excellent student. nor am i an outstanding fool. but i do believe that know more about the world than what was teached in class.

people people

the problem with MIRC is people using it more for fun instead of for education. i do believe that now the tempatation is removed people are performing better academically. this is good but at what cost?

already students only know people from their own class. each one living in their own micro-community. this is probably something that the rector wants. a splintered community with no real connection with each other

i love GV. i met plenty of clever chaps and lassies in there. the difference of age/religion/skin color/stench and batch dissapears. people make friend from different years is by far the best thing that ever came out of GV.

to be honest it was a social experiment by me, tesla_rage and Calgary_ALberta. a small scale antropoligal test to see if internet really doesn't discriminate. in a way the experiment was a success. the friendship we started 7 years ago are still strong.

furthermore it encourages networking between students. you can see ex UTPian helping their juniors in securing jobs/internship. this is good.

with no real interaction like IRC and GV provided the community spirit died. this is the new age of tech.and destroying what was build by the "old guard" is a such a waste.

i have nothing else to say. i dont really care about UTP anymore. to be honest i hate the dystopian route UTP is taking these days. have fun destroying what was once a fun place to be. in 2001 when i first set foot in the college people knows each other. these days they are automaton caring about themselves.

nice! ROBOTS! awesome! keep it up. as expected UTP finally realise its ideals of becoming a conveyor belt!!
Anonymous said…
kage == robot
adam0thman said…
Hehe, kage, very nice!

But it's sad that cowards are still using 'Cik Nony.. yet talking like they-know-it-all.

Hm.. Can't wait for rector's respon.

Erm, one more thing, as Najmie mention, i hope juniors don't just join events for the certificates.. then they'll miss all the extra bits they will get if they do things because they love it...because they want to...

May the Almighty bless us all.

Ok.. out.

//alak
KageSenshi said…
@cik nony 6:59pm

What i meant by no interest in MPPUTP is not "MPPUTP is not interested with IRC". What i meant was, "People no longer interested to become MPPUTP". I believe you know that the previous MPPUTP nomination have very few candidates applying to the point that, all of them win without competition.

Yes, "Excellence in All Areas" is the "Perfect Condition". But we are living in a real world. There are no such thing as "Perfect". You want something, you'll lost something. What needed is to find the "Optimum Point".

You want something, you'll lost something. You create something, you'll destroy something. Every action, there will be reaction. Energy created, energy destroyed. That's the cycle of life. The cycle of energy. That's nature.
penagih_dadih said…
wah lah..finally someone takes the action..good luck kage..

yerp..i agree with some [some je..xbaca sume..hihi..bz duh] of the statements in ur blog..

in the beginning of this semester..evryone in utp..keep cursing the itms because they cant get access trough the internet..

ye la..some of them are final year students..of coz internet the only source for them to find materials or anything informations relates with their project..

my batch also got the same prob..me,myself a chemical student..every weeks we have a lab..when we have a lab..of coz we need to do the report..but,in the weekend..IRC tutup~..so?..where else we want to find info bout our experiment?cafe pak ali?..o yeah..

to kage..again..gud luck..just ignore those who r thinks that he/she do no need internet in his/her life especially he/she already been in UTP for a long time~..extend?..ngehehe..lawak pagi sepam~
KageSenshi said…
@effi weiland

Its good to hear from you again :D. I am one of the people who believe "Humans , are humans - not Malay, not Chinese, not Indian, not Whatever. Just humans, mankind". What separates people are simply what they know and believe in. Being an open source contributor myself, its great to be working with/knowing people from around the world who values you on what you know and believe , ignoring from what country/what race/what religion/how old you are.

I wish more people in UTP (and to some extend, Malaysians), could understand that too.
The Psycho Kid said…
At last, someone rise up to the fact. I know that UTP's top management is quite hard to deal as they are quite stubborn to be tolerant, but at least hopefully some ideas can be achieved from this open letter.

Students actually should be given a chance to potray themselves, whatever it is, as a gamer, forummer, sportsman, IT-geek or whatsoever he is interested. The university should give support to these activities as it enhances student's creativity.

But well, the elders may prefer the old traditional way to educate and enhance the students' potential. However, it's a freedom for a university student to choose their own life.
viralnelly said…
dasar pecah-dan-perintah. itu cara mudah nak memerintah rakyat UTP. student jadi pak turut je.

aku pernah suarakan dalam English Wikipedia pasal UTP culture (section already been removed long time ago). We want to be different but are we really different? every university has their own culture and i think it's an obligation for that culture to stay and growing.

Kalau budak-budak sekarang ni sekadar kenal komuniti course sendiri je, can you imagine how they could fit in bila dah kerja?

terus terang aku cakap, yang dulu-dulu berkobar-kobar cakap benda-benda islamik bila dah kerja semua benda tu dah di tong sampah kan. amik contoh PETRONAS dah la, kalau ada annual dinner and such, mesti ada shows and such dan kadang-kadang dressing derang memang gila jugak.

aku cuma wondering, management UTP tak pernah attend event macam tu ke? patutlah semua benda management sekat, sebab management pun tak rasa. benda macam tu tak salah, as long as controllable.

lagi satu, benda yang makin dihalang, makin tinggi temptation untuk orang commit benda tu. kebebasan tu perlu tapi berpada-pada. Ni bila semua benda management dah stopkan, the generation will be mundane and boring, just like them.

and i wondering, did education alone really dictate how smart you could be?

your intelligent not only on your CGPA but interpersonal skills, EQ, critical thinking etc. Terus terang, belajar kat universiti ni bukan sekadar nak dapatkan ijazah tapi juga nak dapatkan rasa duduk dalam dunia realiti. kalau duduk universiti tapi masih lagi jadi budak sekolah, apa guna? kalau macam tu, baik namakan "Sekolah Teknologi PETRONAS" je.

Mahu student jadi matang tapi semua benda disekat. kata nak melahirkan pemimpin tapi kalau semua benda pun universiti yang kawal, macam mana student ni nak belajar untuk betul-betul memimpin? Mungkin bila dah kerja baru dapat rasa betul-betul memimpin tapi kalau boleh shorten the learning curve, why not?

Bukan semua orang boleh jadi MPP atau RCSU. jadi MIRC membanyakkan golongan yang tak mampu jadi MPP dan RCSU tu untuk jadi pemimpin komuniti sendiri. Itu tak termasuk lagi channel owner, forum moderator and admin dan macam-macam lagi. setiap mereka ni merasa memimpin, berdiplomasi dan membentuk pemikiran komuniti (baik atau tidak, setidaknya mereka bawakan perubahan).

Sekarang ni, semakin kurang yang ada peluang memimpin. Bukan semua orang secara akademiknya bagus, jadi kenapa tak diberi peluang sama rata pada semua orang untuk jadi pemimpin dalam cara mereka sendiri?

Kalau benar UTP masih nilai student sekadar dari akademik dan berapa banyak aktiviti syok sendiri (sorry to say tapi kebanyakkan aktiviti MPP, RCSU dan Rakan Masjid syok sendiri) yang student buat, kita masih jauh nak lahirkan pemimpin yang berkualiti.

entahlah. kesian budak UTP sekarang.
ĸεиلı said…
Good efforts for Kage and everyone who has commented. I am pleased to hear many wise voices here.

Nothing much I would like to say, since many have been stated here. I just hope the UTP management and the Rector can understand the fact that Internet Relay Chat (IRC), Grapevine etc. are pure students' efforts and it is not true to say that they are not bring any good to the students.

Abuses happen in IRC and online forums, just like the Internet itself. But rather than prohibiting the students from using them so that they do not abuse them, the better way is to educate the students the proper way of using them.
penagih_dadih said…
""my batch also got the same prob..me,myself a chemical student..every weeks we have a lab..when we have a lab..of coz we need to do the report..but,in the weekend..IRC tutup~..so?..where else we want to find info bout our experiment?cafe pak ali?..o yeah..""


since my comment before being some jokes by some people in some # [kuangjaq toi hangpa noo..haha]
i'll try to explain what i mean by those words again..

we[my group] go to IRC[library] to find books as our source if in case when the internet is down..so,it'll be a problem if every weekends jeh internet down..sbb time down,[sabtu ahad] library kan tutup~..so,xpat a backup utk cari info2..slalu internet bkn down time weken cm awal2 sem neh..

huhu..hope clear da kot..jgn dok gelak g no~..cet~..igt aku xreti baca kot..haha..
Genjo_Sanzo said…
Hello, and a very good night..

Wow.. It's been a long time since I've seen people discussing something like this. So, let me just go straight to the point.

In my opinion, the open letter is absolutely OK in the perspective of human values. I think as an introductory session for you in the eyes of the rector, this is fine.

In my opinion, for the next step, you could try to investigate the history of the "how" and the "why" UTP chooses the current network system. Discuss it with the IT Department. Do not straight jump to the person in charge. Begin with the low level staffs. Make friend with him/her. If the person is busy, ask him (or "her" to make ourself (a man) to be more "motivated". He he he..) for lunch and discuss it.

Try to ask them for any logs that will prove their statement and the management's decision. Yes I know this is hard, but this will definitely sharpen your negotiation skills. Make an alliance with UTP's counseling staff (since not many students want to meet him/her to be counseled) to strengthened your abilities and also to investigate what type of person you are dealing with and how to negotiate with them.

Ally with as many UTP's departments as you can. Make them acknowledge you. When they have acknowledged your presence, only then you could get support from them.

To strengthened your "human values" points (but to a more 'academic' point of view), I suggest that you could meet the Registrar Department Manager (if I am not mistaken, the current one is Muhamad Nizar bin Mat Nor) to know his point of views regarding the problems which the students faced (academically) that affects their academic performance. Ask him for any relevance data that could strengthened your points. Then, translate the statistic into a graph / chart or something viewable and understandable.

For the problematic students, try also to find any relevance data from any lecturers or staff regarding the student's performance in academic and what is their attitude, features, positive values and also negative values. Because the mentor is the one who judges the character of the mentee. Why this is important? Because as far that I've known, UTP is using "Mentor-Mentee" system for these students. Some may have problematic academic, but have great interpersonal and intrapersonal skills. Some also sux at both. If the student is in you own batch, study them (behaviors, daily habits, schedule, etc) to find the cause that will strengthened your points - if the computer network does actually corrupts them.

Thus, for the technical point of views (from IT Department) and human values point of view (from registrar, lecturer, mentor, mentee) finished.

The next thing is to dig info from management. Try to find in term of "business" point of views. Dig info regarding the cost (of maintenance?) for the previous inter-village network and the current network. Then compare both of them. If you can also dig the company's name of the contractor, find their address/phone number in the Internet and ask them for quotation as your black and white proof. Also ask them on technical stuff on how to still maintain the inter-village connection but at a more lower cost. Learn advance technical stuff from them. If necessary, find any IT students who once have undergone industrial training in that company (refer this info from the Internship Department).

Also learn their perspective towards the previous and current students. This will actually be an additional data for your "human values". If you are great enough, dig upon the person who comes up with the decision to terminate the previous network system and try to understand his point of view. Maybe he was once a UTP student who has a vendetta towards IRC when he was studying? Who knows. Maybe he broke up with his girlfriend in UTPChat. LOL.

Other than that, you should also propose other options in case they are "benak" enough to allow IRC. For example:

- Ask for phone allowance for students to buy a great phone which has that "walkie-talkie" application thingy. Still it is like IRC, and can make channels (only that we use voice).

- For announcement, ask them to place speakers in each house (cannot in lecture halls and library since it will disturb study) and plan on an "announcement room" for students to make announcements. Collaborate with PA System suppliers to compare the cost.


To simplify it, just find any other alternatives and penetrate ALL departments in UTP (even Finance or Human Resource) to gain info from ALL points of views. Then compile all the data in a document called a "WORKING PAPER" (KERTAS KERJA). Send it to the rector and other related departments, then proposed a presentation date to present all those things.

However, it is very hard to do all those in a short time. But, there are no easier way, but still something could be done to smoothe the flow. To infiltrate easily into all departments and to have the "big license" to force all of those people to meet you, you could fight them with their own weapon: EDUCATION!!

So, how?

Take these subjects to have that big license:

1) Cultural Anthropology. Propose your topic as your group project/case study title. Tell Doc Mat (if he still exists) your purpose and your methods in detail. If he gave you other topic, try negotiate to stay with your topic because it relates with other subjects. Then you could do surveys for each mentor/mentee and other departments for your "human values".

2) Professional Communication Skills (PCS). Use the subject to strengthened your presentation. Also, as your 'grand group project', propose the lecturer to evaluate your group presentation in front of the rector with all of the data. You could also use this subject as a licence for your "presentation material" in infiltrating UTP's Departments to dig more info.

3) IT Subjects. Ask your lecturers in the class to relate his/her subject with the UTP's network/computer system. If he/she did not know the answer, he/she will collaborate with IT Department. If he/she is lazy, he/she will order you to ask the IT Department yourself. Use his/her name then as your license to infiltrate.


However, to do all those alone is very hard. Since all of those subjects need group effort, you should have your own team who has the same idea and understanding to take those subjects together.

I have given my opinions. Whether they are beneficial to UTPians or not, I do not know. The rest is up to you.

Good luck.
Mohd Najmie said…
the most important point i find from the letter:

STUDENTS HAVE LOST INTEREST IN MPP

yup
why?
because mpp is useless
mpp is supposed to be a student representative council, a council that represents students' voices, act as an intermediate between students and the management
and what have they come out?
with petition of watercoolers at academic blocks?

the current mpp won their seats without even an election
hence they ARE NOT REPRESENTING THE STUDENTS, because they are not majority-picked
hence the term mpp itself should be void

the only contribution that mpp did to bridge students and management is the mass-ticketing issue in front of V5 cafe (facing V5E block) of motorcycles
the rector heard the students, made that place a parking space

yup, the current rector does listen to the students
but the management are limiting mpp's power that we have to go straight to him
and mpp themselves are not helping

but, frankly speaking here, the thing is

i don't find utpchat and gv or k5 is the big issue of utp students become heartless robots

that's why i ask u
why didn't u give suggestions?
because he could've linked all villages
but i don't think that'll make much difference
or will it?
i don't know
anyway, we all can't wait for his reply
Genjo_Sanzo said…
Oh, I forgot one thing.

If you can liaise with MedTech for your "project", translate all of your data (interviews, charts, graphs, explanation just like "The Mating Habits of Earthbound Humans" film documentary)in CDs. Then distribute to other students as info for them to be aware of. Or rather, to save cost, share it in YouTube is enough.

Make a professional documentary (or rather, a "reality show" but in a more educated version?). Not emotional one. But the most important thing is the end of the content is your own presentation in front of the rector. Record his reactions. Only then you could predict the outcome from his reactions.

Use whatever UTP's facilities / clubs / organizations / workers for your own advantage.

Just an additional rough idea. How to suit your situation, and how to arrange your strategy, those are yours to command.
KageSenshi said…
@Genjo_Sanzo

Thanks for the suggestions!!!. I will try to apply which that I see fit for the situation.

P/S: I'm confident with my tech capacity. And lots of people who actually dealed with / met me know that ;) .


@Najmie

Yup, the current situation with MPPUTP is very bad. People lost interest to be MPP coz they no longer feel their voices would be heard, they lost their confident of free speech, they have lost their sense of responsibility as a community representative. Those who joined MPPUTP are more likely those who want a good thing to put on their resume, instead of those who want to protect the students rights. This , IMO, is related to the downfall of UTPchat and Grapevine. For years, UTPchat and Gvine somehow became the symbol of Free Speech and Community in UTP.

==
that's why i ask u
why didn't u give suggestions?
==

I don't want to give suggestions this early because I believe I need more input from multiple point of views on this issue. If I suggest something from only my point of view, it might not desirable from UTP management's point of view, it might not be desirable from ITMS point of view, it might not desirable from lecturers point of view.

I am not a know-it-all-wiseman, neither I trying to be one. But I am a pragmatic technologist. I decide based on the informations that I know and understand. Issues like this affects multiple side of people, not only students. So suggesting only from a student point of view doesn't feel fair to me because we need to consider other concerns from the other sides. This is so that the suggestion derived from the data, can be acceptable by all concerned sides.

==
because he could've linked all villages
but i don't think that'll make much difference
or will it?
==

Frankly I'm saying this, IMO, It won't. I am a sysadmin and a network admin too. I understand some of the reasons of the split and I agree with it. While it would be nice if its back merged as one, I don't feel like there's a need to push the merge.

I know from the student's point of view, they hated the split and said its not reasonable. But as a sysadmin and a network admin point of view, there is a technical reason behind that which students cant understand (perhaps the skilled one can, but those who dont understand it will only raise more blames and complains). Do normal students care about the technical reasons?, NO. Do a fellow technologist who have been on a similar seat care? YES (well, at least I care :P ).

That's why I don't want to suggest anything this early, different point of view have different concerns. One person's medicine might be another person's poison. Until I have more information from the ITMS and UTP management's concern about this, I can't decide on any suggestions yet until I have those information.
KageSenshi said…
Seems like Friday's working hours has ended, and there are no reply from the rector yet. I think the rector might be occupied today. Guess I will wait until next week for the reply.

In the meantime, I will be documenting the ideas which are currently in my head during this weekend. They does not consider all point of view, so I wont says that they are suggestions, but rather a collection of ideas.

I hope I have enough time for describing them as a group detailed action plans.
washing said…
I dont think Rector care and give a damm about this. This are perkara lama dah.

btw good effort! :D
aXeLia said…
dont you guys realized that now we have UTPNetMy, an online community for utp/exutp/academics/non-academic who want to appoint their opinions.

Buat apa susah2 org wujudkan community tu kalau tak diguna pakai..

kalau kata die hard fans GV, skang boleh la die hard fans UTPNetMy (UTP = UNITE THE PEOPLE)

Nak MIRC? Orang cakap, kalau tak dapat apa yang dikehendaki, cuba cari other solution.. cth kalau xder santan dr kelapa, santan dari kotak pun jadilah

and dalam dunia nie, of course tak akan dapat sama dengan apa yang kita nak kan?
KageSenshi said…
@washing

If he dont, I will keep bugging him until he will. I AM a persistent brat :P. I believe that something should be done no matter what. Its either Do, or Die to me now. UTPchat is dying, and I can't let it die. Fyi. my experience in UTPchat as the main network and system administrator, contributed a lot to my job skills currently. I owe UTPchat and its community my gratitude for that, and this is the least I can do before I end my studies - to stop UTPchat from dying, and to revive it as a greater infrastructure than its predecessor with a community that values technology and knowledge.

p/s: MPP should be persistent brats too when protecting student's rights. Don't easily give up with the stubbornness of the management. Keep on fighting!. Even the hardest rocks cracks if you keep on heating and cooling it.

@axelia

I know UTPNetMy for months, and i've visited the site, IMO, there are different of target here. I am trying to revive a dying community, not create a new one. I don't believe on forking would get us anywhere. UTPchat and GV fell because of the attack being put on them, which caused both of them to lose momentum, and Grapevine to die simply like that. What I am fighting for here is to stop this conflict in a practical manner, and hopefully, being able to maintain the existence of UTPchat, hopefully revive GV, and who knows, maybe something new will come out of this, a new community, or a new internet culture perhaps.

Btw, if the users know the existence, know what they can and cannot benefit from it, and they chosed not to use it, I don't really mind. Why? because I believe in Freedom of choice. Its their choice. However, if they are not exposed to it, chosen not to use it because of the wrong impression set by UTP, the wrong impression set by people who dont understand the values, I felt pity for them. This is currently one of my missions, to fix the impressions set by those who don't understand the technology.
sebenarnye lame dah aku nk komen, tp tak jumpe butang post komen hahahaha. sengal aku. aku ckp bahasa melayu (rojak) je lah eh?

anyway, tq lah kage kerana menulis surat sebegini. aku seriously tak tahu ape respon yg akan ko dapat nanti despite dah berkecimpung sekian lama dengan mirc n gv seperti bbdak lain.

aku stuju gak dengan effi, orang salah guna mirc n gv tu utk fun yg terlebih, resultnye jdlaa ade yg bengong2 hahaha. dak gitu?

tapi aku tak sangkal mmg kegunaan die agak besar. esp part merapatkan silaturrahim antara student. kalu tak kerana benda nih, agak payah aku nak kenal senior kat atas yang byk level, ataupun junior yg baru masuk, idung pon berhingus lagi. secara tak langsung, kita friendly dengan sume lapisan.. takde dah "batch ko.. batch ko.. batch aku.. batch aku saje".

tapi nk buat camne... transition.. perubahan... dan yang sewaktu dengannya mmg terkenal dengan sifat susah utk diterima. kalau dalam budaya masyarakat, kadang2 tu sampaikan ambik masa beratus2 tahun utk sesebuah masyarakat menerima satu budaya. jadi apa yang terjadi kat utp sekarang nih mmg satu perkara yang normal. Apa yang tak normalnya adalah cubaan mereka2 yang ingin menaikkan GV dan MIRC dlm utp tu, memang bertentangan arus walaupun tau akan menempuh macam dugaan. good job n good effort.

so, selamat maju jaya, aku juga dah tak berapa amik kisah dengan utp. takde give n take langsung. igt lagi tahun2 sebelum nih, tanya bdak2 u lain mesti kenal bdak utp sbb bdak utp mostly dah train utk bergaul beramas mesra. skang nih, tau utp tpt orang genius2 stuck up jer.

huhuhuhuhu.
lupe nak tambah...

dulu masa aku ade kat utp lagi, ircop sume dah pernah hantar surat berkenaan perkara ini kat rektor. tp bukan open letter, cuma drpd kami ke rektor thru mpp. kitorang ade sediakan point2 serta data2. tak caya leh tanye soulblade, vivre dan lain2. cuma kalu tak salah aku, outcomenya hanyalah satu meeting rasmi dengan mpp.. ade orang itms skali kot.. pastu senyap begitu saja.

seingat aku lah...
vivre said…
Yeap, kita pernah draft that letter, and I do remember sending it to Rektor :)

Following that, rektor reply cakap nak jumpa, tp aku rasa kita tak g jumpa pun, Rektor just jumpa ngan ITMS.. =(

Btw, Snub, ko still ada presentation slides tue tak ? Bleh bagi kat derang neh.. I think we made comprehensive list of reasons why UTPChat should be left alone..
kechi said…
yo kage.. akechi a.k.a nates in da houseee (everybody raised up ur hands bebeh~~)

long time no hear from you..hehehe..i've read all the comments above and i find there are a lot of ways that have been suggested..therefore, i won't give any at the moment..

as the previous ircop,server operator for v3 and gv mod, i really give my gratitude to you for trying to revive back the old legacy of us, such as vivre,soulblade,snubby etc..

and yes, we already sent a letter to them and waiting for the so called meeting session which is never been called until i left utp, go and work and now already continuing my masters degree..

well,i do hope that the rector will read this letter..

will follow up this thread..
nanti aku carik lah vivre.. tp rasenye dah takde kot. itu time pc lame. skang pc dah baru huhuhu. content pon mostly baru :p

ape2pon biar aku carik dulu.
Anonymous said…
totally agree with you, something has to be done, we cannot sit back anymore, through all the events i have joined, i observed that all your claims are valid and true, the management team doesn't know what they have done because they are not us. We know the best for us. Stand up and voice out.
KageSenshi said…
He replied, good:

==============
Thank you for the letter . I will be writing shortly to all students on matters about blogs and disseminating of unnecessary information . Whatever UTP is doing is for the interest of all and not to certain individuals only . We are also monitoring situations and some will face discipline action soon for disseminating information against our own rules and regulations .

Thank you,

Dr Zainal Abidin Hj. Kasim
Rector/CEO
Universiti Teknologi PETRONAS
Bandar Seri Iskandar
31750 Tronoh
Perak Darul Ridzuan
Malaysia
Tel : +605-368 8181
Fax: +605-368 8113
Email : zainaks@petronas.com.my
===========

I will wait for what he "will be writing shortly to all students on matters about blogs and disseminating of unnecessary information" before replying.

Currently it seems like he did not get the point here (just like how I expected). I will wait for what he is going to write anyway.

those who have commented, more comments?

I am putting up a document at http://devel.foss.org.my/~kagesenshi/pub/colUTPit/. I actually wanted to keep it until its finished, but well, it looks like I should make it public early :)
Y0nd13 said…
@axelia

Like kage said, the feasibility of the technology and flexibility of choices is what we want to nurture .

Heck, instead of making an online community UTP.XXX.XXX version, facebook and mugshot sudey (sorry not a friendster fan).

@kagesenshi

Muhaha looks like a long battle in front of us. To do or not to do?
ĸεиلı said…
@kagesenshi

I feel so sorry to you.

The people 'here' are still too defensive towards open critics. When the people 'here' hear the things that are less preferable to them, they say it is 'an act of disseminating unnecessary information'. I thought UTP practices global culture which welcomes critiques and promotes improvements while at the same time practices good Eastern values, but it seems like I was wrong.

I used to be proud of UTP for everything, i.e. the facilities, the students, the culture, etc. Now I am still proud of everything of UTP except for this over-defensiveness. =|
-Pinkie ChiRa- said…
i think im in love.

ok,dont get freaked out just yet. i think i love the post more than you coz till now i didnt know that such person exist in UTP.

first of all, MERCI for writing this letter and posting it up. fyi, im also in a process of writing a 'nice' long letter to the rector but please, i didnt know the existance of your blog, so u cant frame me of copying ur action.

and im very extremely IMPRESSED that the fluent-in-english malays are still existing in utp. it's such a great pity that they emphasize SO much about the medium of communication here aka english since the educamp but the elearning scarred me of utp's horrifying level of english the very first time me and my friends logged on to it. and no one except me noticed the mistakes.

just imagine, i was laughing hyterically in irc while the others questioned my actions.

recently, i had a couple of long check with some really lovely lecturers about the issues happening in utp like the savage hunt of getting a perfect 4.0 and the bahaviours of students nowadays and im fairly proud to say that they commented that they were really impressed to hear that from a student for the longest time ever.

call me an obnoxious brat, but i speak my mind. i dont care who the hell you are, may you be the rector or lecturer, once u strike a conversation with me, u have to listen to everything i say, and i daresay i say it without beating around the bush. but of course, i do not cross the borders of rude and ill-mannered. my singaporean malay mother and chinese father brought me up to be a talented polite 'speaker'.

although im only in foundation, july 07's batch, i agree with everything you say, except the part about grapevines and utpchat because in my mind, grapes crawling on fences kept popping into my mind while utpchat gives me the impression that utp once had services like msn chat.

as a foundation student, i came to utp mainly because of my parents and the freaking scholarship tho i can actuallt afford to go anywhere but who in the right sense of mind would actually turn down a fully paid education by petronas. and with brilliant stories about the glory of utp and how much i excelled in the educamp's interview session, i came here with an enthusiastic heart.

currently, im in 2nd sem of my foundyland and i have absolutely not the slightest idea on how will i survive the upcoming years in utp. i practically died of the heat, the extorbitant amount of FLIES, the mindless people here and the stupid riduculous all-rounder graduate motto that keeps ringing at the back of my mind.

okay,how the hell do we actually achieve this all-round thing? HELLO. people in utp care nothing more that to get 4.0 4.0 4.0 4.0 and a plethora of certificates and good reviews for themselves. just look at the activities conducted here. have you ever seen a group actually liking the thing that theyre doing, not for the certificate or 'my resume's gonna be the bomb for joining this' attitute but the actual self-satisfaction of joining it just for the love and passion for it?

no. it's soooo damn rare like the locals and internationals having mee goreng together at a mamak stall.

oh and you know what? the people here SUCK. how can we be all-rounded graduate if the stupid graduate who scored 4.0, 1st class honour blablabla is a freaking racist? why dont you see malays with chinese or internationals and locals joking with each other or sabahans having a laugh over what happened at petaling street with their johorian friends?

why are there groups of sarawakians at one side, a group of indians at another, a bunch of malays standing by the lamp-post pole and a gang of modern kl people under the tree?

why do i have my own friend coming up to me, asking why i get along so well with my chinese peeps and how can i know all the international students? who do i have guys looking at me with a disgusted face just because i speak damn fluent english and is not conservative like some others?

why am i, a girl from a city in selangor is actuallt DISCRIMINATED just because i do not wear the tudung or dont close my eyes when i see girls in underwear parading over the tv screens? why do people stay away from me when i speak my mind, have friends from all races and has a very modern view on life?

i used to blog on utp's website, started just a month from the day i entered into utp. i blogged regularly, have my friends read my blog (non narrow-minded ones, duh) who warned me about the chances that someone like the rector who would prolly murder me if he laid his eyes on it. i told them that i couldt actually care less, i see no wrong and he should be given an insight about what is actually happening in utp from the pov of a new student.

and you know what happened? after coming back from the longlong dec break, i was shocked to find that we cnt access the site's blog entries. mind you, i was the only one who blogs, but i have a couple of friends who write in too, occasionally. so we can still blog, without showing the world what we were typing.

and the very next few days, they took the whole blogging system out of utp's elearning.

they should thank their luckiest stars in the universe that i actually copied pasted almost all my blog entries into my new blog and actually had them printed out. (i thrive in reading my own works as some others just find my musings hilarious, thank you very much) i didnt dwelve on it too much and went on with my dull life in utp.

during my elearning blogging days (i still blog, ranting is part of my life, sad so say), i received a myriad of comments. i enjoyed comments and flames, and im happy to say that the boys always find me interesting hahaha. they flamed alot, who knew that the males here are so *bleepbleep*. i was amused at them asking, oops, i meant, ordering me to leave utp if i complain too much about utp. well, who doesnt complain?

i never bothered you lot anyway. i didnt go to your rooms and stalking you into signing a petition to have an ice-skating rink being built by demolishing the sports complex or crazy things of the sort. obviously, im not in love with utp. and im definitely not the kind who keeps the hell of me quiet. i love literature, i love to vent my feelings through writing.

and yes, i do enjoy trashing their comments back and dedicating a whole blog post (in elearning) just for my 'spammers' where my readers fall of their chair just reading a few lines of it.

the reason why i didnt want to write to the rector or someone of authority about this is because someone close to me is working in petronas and knows the 'big people' personaly. and yeah, i have to take good care of my dignity and their pride but as time goes by.. i think that as a place of education, utp should not be tarnished by these petty issues.

during educamp, we are told that utp is one of the most renowned university on the WORLD. it's quite hard to belive for most of my parent's friends went 'petronas has a university' when they ask where im studying and 'wow youre going to toronto (canada)' instead of tronoh when they ask where it is.

renowned university?

let me swallow my water so that i can throw my head back, laughing out loud.

personally, i do not see why some commenters (i know there's no such word) said that this letter whould not be published on a blog. nor do i understand why must the blog on elearning be taken down. or why must the rector be so offended as to give us a, what did he say, talk?? note?? about blog and God knows what he said, to the students.

as bloggers, we have full right to comment on things, look, we dont 'mogok' or have campaigns or petitions but we only blog for what is right. the ones who are delusional and say that utp is the best place on earth, good luck to you when i take over the world.

blogging about issues is no big deal, if i dont like it, i move on. if i take interest in it, i read and i ponder. same goes to you guys out there. if u are offended, forget about it. chances are that you may not know the person (till the day your body is rotten and gone) or have the person sued. you dont see kenny sia being sued or brought to court, do you? sides, what he's blogging is even heavier compared to the petty issues of utp.

it is not wrong to dislike utp. it is not wrong to like it either. im also not saying that utp should change it's systems just to justify our needs to save face. we are just highlighting the ways that it can be improved. i can say that i dislike my house but does that make it unattractive? people still come over for open house or to hangout.

when we say that utp is this that this that, do u see lesser students coming in? do u see people doing graffiti "utp is a *bleeptootbeep"? no right? i mean, look. this has been going on for semesters. we say that the conditions of cafes like the flies is unbearable and the mak cik charges so expensively but does it change? the flies still buzz happily around and the mak cik still grins when she sees you lining up to pay that nasi lemak kosong that u will pay more than the original price.

even though we critisize utp, it's not that we hate it till the extent of burning it down, no. we are pointing out its flaws on hopes that it will be mended, looked into and improve to a level that is satisfactory to all parties. it's not to say that we like other places better, they also have their flas. where can you find an irc that is as big and pretty like utp's?

where can you find pak guards that let you go when you dont wear youre matrix id tag? where can you find a chancellor's hall with foldable seats and aircond vents that look like pipe holes? where can you find a place so hot like no other and be proud that you are getting a nice tan while walking to class?

no matter how we view utp, we do bear in mind about the sake of others. who doesnt want a better place to be in? who want to stay at a place that is all bad or all goody goody and boring?

utp is exciting. we face soooooooooooooo many problems, but yet, we still remain here. you dont see people throwing away the scholarship and packing their bags to leave, every single day just because we are blogging or sending letters to the rector that utp is so and so..

just think it this way, if one person is making an effort to improve the condition that will make your life better, and another is continuing his/her effort, wouldnt you agree to what he/she is doing?

i know i wrote a thesis instead of a comment. sorry if it offended any party. i have a strong feeling that there will be alot of typos. sorry about that too.

dont diss my long essay entry. if u noticed, i havent started on mpp yet. no one forced you to read it. blame your curiosity for reading this and feel frustrated/anger/sadness/joy/etc.

now, excuse me while i join the screaming commotion outside caused by the mosquito-killing white fog.
-Pinkie ChiRa- said…
eh, i meant that i had a CHAT, not check.. omg.. so embarrassing...

and the ammount of typos make me look as if im some retarded typist.

uhuk uhuk.k
aalim said…
to cik nony..
it's not that hard to select radio and type ur name...

x tau la kot2 pasni utp akan release code of ethics/conduct/policy in blogging :D
kechi said…
i will be damned if utp enforces such policy on blogging ethics or what so ever..

internet is free (of coz we pay for it), which we free to do what we want to do..

in certain part,i agree with sera..we,as ex-utpians already faced that long time ago.. and hopw newa generations will take over our legacy and continuing on fighting for other students
-Pinkie ChiRa- said…
omggggg.. mampos kalu utp kuarkn some rules n regs bout blogging.. i'll DIE.
ĸεиلı said…
well said, -Pinkie ChiRa-.
I have to agree with what you have mentioned. But things like 'blogging rules' or 'blogging policy' infringes our rights to speak as netizens, so I will ignore them. They cannot charge us on the court as long as we state the facts and the truths.

If the authority thinks that we criticize UTP because we do not love UTP then they are wrong. It's the total opposite - we criticize because we love and care about UTP. We want it to improve, for ourselves, for the following generations, and for UTP itself. And if the they are afraid of the 'disseminating of unnecessary information', then make UTP a place where 'disseminating of unnecessary information' is not needed at all. I believe 'unnecessary disciplinary actions' will cause further 'disseminating of unnecessary information', which in the long run will further draw attentions of the world.

@kagesenshi
why don't you put a world map of where your visitors are from on your blog to show them how many people in the world is reading your blog?
ĸεиلı said…
@kagesenshi
opps, you have one already!
But it's not significant to me, placed at a tiny corner with ad links and banners around...
Take a larger one and put at a focus spot in the site.
ĸεиلı said…
http://maps.amung.us/

forgot the link! lol~
Mighty_Jacksparrow reporting. Management administrator for Kampung5 Forum and a former Grapeviner.

Some did talk about GV and I'm dropping a few lines of thoughts that may show the differences between now and then.

GV was classic. Nothing compares. The levels of discussions and critical thinking are very challenging that most people stay away from getting into the hard stuff, but as to compare to the current forum we have the level of maturity and the so called challenge has dropped to a level where somehow I personally feel like im entertaining a bunch of sorry but entertaining tiny cupcakes.

The operators in MIRC are as well less alert and dedicated like the last time when UTPchat was still around. Not all though, but the pattern of declination is there.

I have been here for more than 5 years. I dedicated my life to our forums, both GV and K5 for almost 4 years now. And i must say that the interaction, the passion has declined to a state where almost everybody is idle.

The only Grapeviners whom i knew off and are still around are Mahen, Silu (ex-mod, GV) F00_FIGHTERS and ..yeah i think thats about it. And we're becoming less interested to join in because the spirit is no longer there. It has vanished.

But i believe that is how things change. One day or another the youngsters will replace us old nuts with their own ways and identities. Especially the arrogant ones, of course.

Being the successor and what not to bring down the culture we once had is so hard these days. People don't even bother chatting anymore. At least not that hardcore as we're once were. nobody cares about each other. the only people who get freaked whenever MIRC is down are us GV time kiddos.

It is sad, really. Owh how much i miss GV. Hardly anyone talks about the hard stuff nowadays. I miss Effi's sense of british humor and the existence of those GV Legends.

But im proud with you young one. You have the energy still. Keep on it and make us old timers proud with you. I have made it this far to help the forumming activity in UTP but, yeah everyone has to leave someday, right?

God be with you.
mrfusyi said…
We speak our minds, and when we don't have the chance to, we write it out..in blogs!
Setting up boundaries for blogging in UTP? What are we? Mindless termites?
I may not blog as much, but I relish the chance to speak what's on my mind,and this talk about putting a barricade on it is just..unimmaginable.

Yes, GV was once a place for fellow students to speak out, talk out, and yes, sometimes even brag out..still, case in point, its a place where some serious thought can be put out in the open and for some serious C&C to be exchanged..student with student, mind vs mind, thought for thought..

where else can hundreds of students gather casually, comfortably, discussing away on matters that are of concern to us as student..its a chance to pick our minds, jog it once in a while on current issues of concern, aside from the daily lectures and academics we feed it daily..



@ĸεиلı

totally agreeing with u seeing that UTP management considers all comments directed towards it as a direct attack on its pristine image..
yes, some are comments aimed with foul intention, but how else can we as a university better ourself if we shut away all the critics in the gallows..

so ok, GV might not be back up after this, but least provide students a channel or route where they can gather there in the masses..for sake of bettering student community..and for sake of making UTP ideal for those budding well versed engineers to come..

cheers
-Pinkie ChiRa- said…
*kenji - thankees thankees. (squeals)

mpp is so unorganized till it's not funny anymore. why most people here do things 6.30 one?? it's so damn freaking FRUSTRATING. i think right, to change utp, we shouuld change the PEOPLE in it. like cut their skulls, clorox their brains and voila..

if only it's THAT simple.

CHANGE people, change. we're suppose to be the perintis of the leaders.

im im mpputp pr's dept but we're doing things so nicely. thank God that almost evry1 is cool.

or else i'd bleach all of you.

p/s-6.30 is half past six, incase you were wondering whether i was talking early dinner time.
-Pinkie ChiRa- said…
i can never get a comment/blog/forum/anything post typo free, can't i?

*scratches dictionary*
Abe said…
lagi 1 hal paling penting,
most of our guards,like to summon students ESPECIALLY male students...
Don't you all think this is SUCK?
KageSenshi said…
@-Pinkie ChiRa-

Typos are normal, happens to me everytime - especially when my brain goes faster than my typing.

Uslens it cgahnes the minaeng, jsut dnot behtor aobut it, as haumn biarn can fuirge it out.

^-^
KageSenshi said…
@Abe

erm, totally unrelated to the issue i'm trying to raise.

never had any problem with guards regarding fine tickets. unless its me myself who did something wrong - of which i am aware of.

dare to gamble with rules which can made u being fined, don't complain when u got fined. A very simple rule. But if you did not do anything wrong, well , thats another case. How about you raise about the issue somewhere? Your blog perhaps?. And make sure u don't do it anonymously, be responsible of what u put on the net.

(note i dont use the word "summons". Why?, because "summons" in legal means "a request for you to appear in court". Certainly not those fine tickets)
-Pinkie ChiRa- said…
*kagesenshi - that is extreme weih. funny. waaa.. chira kena perli. kidding. yeap, i so agree. it's like we want to get everything out and not looking back at what we're doing and when we do.. jeng jeng jeng.

=) eh, late d. wanna sleep.
pink chira, bagus tulisan ko. well done. panjang tapi aku baca sampai habis.

welcome to neo-utp. huhuhu.

mungkin ko tak sempat kenal gv atau mirc atau apa apalah, dan aku pun faham situasi ko. yg kelompok ni duduk sana, kelompok tu duduk sinun....

untuk memberi sedikit info kepada semua esp generasi neo-utp, ketika kewujudan gv n mirc, perkara sebegitu dikurangkan dengan drastik. yep. semuanya bercampur gaul (well except those biru..eh, biro surau). itupun ada gak orang biro surau yg bercampur sekali. hebat tak hebat penangan bila kita buang dinding yang menyekat kita bertukar fikiran.

sampai sekarang, aku baik dengan 2-3 orang senior daripada sarawak (ada yang kahwin tapi tak boleh nak pergi kenduri sana naik belon). senior2 nih kalau ikutkan situasi neo-utp, mmg agak mustahil untuk aku kenal, kalau tak kerana adanya tempat untuk berhubung.

dan sampai sekarang, aku juga baik dengan non-malay ex forumer. ok, itu akulah, jenis yang mudah baik dengan orang, tapi jenis yang susah pun boleh juga, so itu bermaksud ianya menjadi kan.

jadi di sini, poin penting kage ialah untuk menghidupkan kembali komuniti yang worth it seperti GV n mirc dulu. tak semestinya menggunakan nama yang sama. tapi itulah, generasi kage sekarang mmg agak kasihan, kerana tak seperti generasi kami... sekarang dah jadi neo-utp, semua sudah disekat. kalaulah mereka nampak... kalaulah...

dulu ada pepatah 'mata pena lebih tajam daripada mata pedang'. sekarang aku rasa 'keyboard lebih tajam daripada mata pena itu sendiri'. itu yang mereka takutkan.

takut pada bayang-bayang sendiri.
-Pinkie ChiRa- said…
* snubby, don of anime.

oh cool. pink chira. that was the original nickname given before i modified it to pinkie chira.

ok. im getting way side-tracked here.

terima kasih banyak banyak. sebenarnya, saya pun tak tahu apa yang saya taip. hal ini disebabkan saya suka menaip apa yang terlintas dalam fikiran saya. jadi, kalau kamu perasan, 'karangan' saya itu bukan konsisten.

saya suka menulis karangan.

dan karangan yang saya tulis semuanya gempak-gempak belaka.

XD
-Pinkie ChiRa- said…
*tidak. not bukan.

tsk tsk ChiRa, and u call urself expert in BM.

*claps hand*

way to go way to go.
KageSenshi said…
A little heads up for those who are still reading only this one post.

The rector has replied, and here's my reply:

http://blog.kagesenshi.org/2008/03/re-open-letter-for-rector-of-utp.html
Anonymous said…
I didn't know that there are still humans in utp.An excellent article.
I have found other blogs talk about utp.here are their links :
http://strandedguy.blogspot.com/
http://stingray7109.blogspot.com/2008/03/my-life-in-utp.html
underoath said…
do you really think IRC will make more people vote for MPP??

seriously no i dont think so. i was there like 3 years ago (when all villages connected as a whole), and during the s0-called election, not even one single soul from our houses went there to vote.

what im saying is the poor performance of the election is nothing to do with the IRC. the REAL problem is, look at 'them';the 'big player',craving for meaningless power, and all-i-want-is just-the-popularity glamorous shit with a bullshitting manifestos candidates; really brought me to not have my lunch at ali's (coz of the posters). who really wants to vote?

it comes to a point that i think the election is just a 'show' where at the end of the show we just punched our own faces because we watched it for no reason.

btw, mpp is nothing..they just eat whatever management eat..if u know what i'm saying..

all of these is just my IMHO

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